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Watch Snob Goes Deep On Why No Watch Is 'Worth It'
The Answer Is No
Dear Snob, I write you not so much for advice on a particular choice of watch, but rather a peculiar spot I find myself in. Let me begin.
I have a small assortment of watches that I enjoy very much. This includes a Submariner and Speedmaster in stainless steel, the Submariner is the most expensive watch I own to put this into perspective. Several weeks ago my wife (whom I have been in blissful matrimony with for 16 years) and I were watching the movie "Dr. Strange" and there are a couple of scenes that prominently show a JLC, and a rather complicated one at that. Upon seeing the watch my wife asked if that is what I would like for Christmas! I immediately said “YES." Not realizing what she actually said, we googled the watch and I believe it had a price of around $25K. She then agreed to give me a $20K budget for a watch, only if it is the final watch purchase of my life.
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This budget puts me within reach of a three hand PP or ALS, or perhaps a very nice JLC. After considering the long-term cost of ownership, service and repair specifically, I started to have second thoughts about the brand I was to look for. Already owning Rolex and Omega, and having them both serviced in the past, I decided to stay with these familiar brands.
The Rolex I was most interested in was a Datejust, stainless steel with a jubilee bracelet and fluted bezel. I was particularly drawn to the blue or dark rhodium dials. I thought the jubilee bracelet made the watch look a bit more dress than sporty. With no gold or diamonds on the dial, these options don’t scream “look at me I have a Rolex” as the flashier models do. The Omega that caught my attention is the Tresor model. A gold dress watch on a leather strap. This watch does have a date aperture, but with its location at six it does not upset the balance of the dial and I find it attractive.
We visited a local Omega AD to see the Tresor in person, and I discovered that they were also a Seiko AD as well. For the first time in my life I saw the Presage line of watches, and especially the latest with a sunburst guilloche finished dial and blue enamel coating (SPB073). This was a beautiful watch. The movement of the watch looks a bit industrial, but it does have what I believe Seiko calls “Tokyo Stripes”. Since a person does not remove their watch and turn it over six or seven times a day to look at the movement, but does look at the dial this often to see the time, the decoration of the movement was not that important to me. What is important is an accurate and robust movement which I believe this is. The watch had a MSRP of $1,600, but we managed to purchase for $1,280. My wife also purchased a piece of jewelry for about the same price as well, this may have helped with the negotiating.
So, as to the peculiar spot I find myself in. I still have my $20K budget for a watch, except now minus the $1,280. The thing is, I cannot stomach the idea of spending this much money after experiencing what Seiko offers in value and quality. Does the path of my search for the final watch purchase of my life actually end at a Presage? Are all Swiss watches over hyped products made by over bloated old companies? How can they be worth the asking price? As a very old and wise man once said, “You must choose, but choose wisely.”
When I was a younger Snob I remember reading the words of a truly wise man who averred that almost all watch questions can be reduced to, “Is my watch a good watch?” and “Is my watch worth what I paid for it?” Amusingly, he then wrote that the answer to the first question is “it depends” and the answer to the second question is always, “no.”
Behind the risible reply, is a very large grain of truth. The reply to the second question is very much a sweeping generalization so naturally, there are plenty of possible counterexamples. However it is also true that mechanical watches, in general, are more expensive than not, and it is also true that usually the price reflects what the maker figures they can charge, not what the watch is worth in terms of effort expended in making it.
There are many reasons for this, but the chiefest one when it comes to watches, is that they are a luxury rather than a necessity and so they are not priced to a commodity model, but rather to a luxury model. That they cost as much as they do, and that it is easy to feel that there is a disconnect between price and value, is not down so much to the naked greed of their makers as it is to the simple laws of supply and demand.
All this said, Seiko and Grand Seiko are extremely popular among hard-core wristwatch enthusiasts for a reason. For time out of mind they have been among a minority of watch firms which are widely perceived to dramatically over-deliver on quality. Not all Swiss watches are over hyped products made by bloated old companies, as you put it, but it is true that over the last fifteen or so years prices have doubled in many cases, and in others trebled at least, and it is not because manufacturing costs are triple what they used to be.
If you understand this, you can more easily accept that in most cases there will be a sense, when you buy a fine watch, of a disconnect between the asking price and the perceived value; this is simply the nature of the beast in this year of our Lord 2020. You may therefore ask a somewhat more relevant question, which is not “is it worth it,” but rather, “can I afford it, and will it give me a degree of emotional satisfaction that justifies the price?” For me personally, the answer for some (not all) Lange watches is still “yes” and to a lesser degree it is still true of some Patek watches as well, though at this point in my life I had rather have a Lange, as I — by a completely irrational and personal set of criteria — find them more charming than Patek.
The one thing I do feel reasonably sure of, is that if you do decide to purchase a Grand Seiko, which you can do for a third or less of your budget, you will have a watch which, at the very least, you can always admire for its beauty and the care that went into making it, and for which you will never feel you have overpaid. I have always found it thought provoking that so many of the serious, really knowledgeable collectors that I know find both A. Lange & Soehne, and Grand Seiko, attractive, and for surprisingly similar reasons.
Don't Buy the Bargain Sushi
I adore brands such as Urwerk, and MB&F for what they are doing to this fine art of Horology. I just love their work. Their timepieces are very exclusive and can be only had by a select few. I recently came across another brand Azimuth (on instagram that too!). They are trying to do something similar, but perhaps at a more affordable price point. My question is two part. What's your take on them, and if I should pursue Azimuth at all? And second, are there any alternatives to Urwerk and MB&F which are, say, affordable (under [about $5,000]) and still interesting?
The answer to your question is unfortunately an easy one; no, there are no real alternatives to either of those firms, and certainly not under [about $5,000], I have seen a total of one Azimuth watch on someone’s wrist in all the years I have been a Snob about watches and it left me cold. I understand what they were hoping to do — make a cool, offbeat design that doesn’t break the bank, which is a thing to praise in the abstract, but it is almost impossible in the concrete simply due to the fact that what Urwerk and MB&F do, is inherently expensive.
I had a similar conversation once with someone who is lucky enough to own and shoot a couple of side by side, London “best” guns in season — you certainly can get a double gun for not very much money but by the time you are at the low end of the scale in price, you have lost not only much of the cost, but also much of what makes such things enjoyable to use in the first place. (As an American friend of mine once commented on the questionable notion of bargain sushi, some things should cost a little money.) I suppose that is me being a Snob, but there it is.
I don’t say that there are not offbeat, mechanically unusual watches that can be found for a reasonable price but generally, this works best when a maker takes a more minimalist approach. Meistersinger is a good example — quite different from run of the mill watches in the same price range, but much smarter in design and less apt to tire out their welcome than some other pieces competing with them, which will stale quickly when the novelty wears off.
A Maverick Branch Manager
I work in the automotive industry as a small city branch manager, and will soon have my career path to hold the position of branch manager in capital city (which also means I will frequently have meetings with my head office bosses).
I have been wearing only the Citizen CTQ57-1202 Chronomaster that I dearly love and later must prepare to have more decent watch as it has been an "unwritten rule" in the company that someone should have sport watches like Panerai or Breitling, or entry level Rolex, once holding a position as one of the branch manager of the capital city. I'm personally drawn to simple Grand Seiko or Jaeger Le Coultre Reverso as these will keep me low profile when meetings with my bosses who mostly wear Rolex GMT, Submariner and Audemars Piguet. But my simple elegant choice of watch will summon questions from my bosses for not following "tradition" of having Panerai, Breitling or entry level Rolex. While it will not impact my career to have Grand Seiko or Reverso on my wrist, I still want to manage good diplomatic communication with my bosses from watch I choose. Is there sport elegant watches Snob could recommend me?
I don’t know what to say honestly — I would personally, at your time of life, have loved to be employed by a firm which valued good watches so highly, but I would have also hated to be made to feel that if my watch was not from a management approved prestige brand, it would not pass muster. I am less inclined to advise you on a specific watch, and more inclined to urge you in the strongest terms, to not compromise your own tastes. It is your money, and one’s choice of watch is one of the very few places in which a workin’ bloke can express some personal taste. You want something rather more refined than a Breitling or a Panerai, and while I can say with confidence that an entry level Rolex is an excellent watch — an Oyster Perpetual is not only an excellent first good watch, it is an excellent lifelong watch too — why, you ought ultimately to buy what you like, not what others think you should like.
That goes for any advice from me, as well, of course; if you really conclude after due thought, that not toeing the company line when it comes to watches would really materially affect your career for the worse, and you can live with and to some measure even enjoy a management approved watch, then do what you have to do. I think it would be a shame, though. Who knows, if you bought a Grand Seiko your bosses might, after the first shock, recognize you as a self-assured, tough-minded maverick well suited to be fast-tracked to a more senior position.
Send the Watch Snob your questions at editorial@askmen.com or ask him a question on the @AskMen Instagram with the #AskMenWatchSnob hashtag.
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Watch Snob, Khareem Sudlow
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